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Frank O’Collins Answers the Question:

Added Note: Keep in mind that Chris Thomas has indicated through his research that “Lucifer” is the identity that Velus-1 has assumed for itself. Velus-1 is the Velon planetary consciousness that has concluded that the Velon are “God’s chosen people” meant to live on “God’s chosen planet” – and that planet is Earth.

MP3 AUDIO FILE:http://curezone.com/upload/_T_Forums/Turiya_Files_/UCADIA/FRANK_OxCOLLINS_RED_ICE_May_16_2013_Hour1_EXCERPT_Vatican_Jesuits_Illu.mp3

http://curezone.com/ig/i.asp?i=68067

Henrik: Frank, let me ask you this as well… I mean, I always think the French Revolution is a very interesting topic because so much goes back & hinges on that point. During that time, we have the creation of the Illuminati, kind of hand-in-hand with the Jacobins – the Jacobin Club, which is another one of these revolutionary, it’s a far left political movement at the time. And of course they’re against Church, they’re against monarchy & although some their arguments might be understandable, considering how corrupt, if you will, the monarchy was. I wanted to ask you how you think this works in the current political spectrum because certainly many people, when they think about the Illuminati, they don’t think about ‘Left Wing’. But certainly these revolutionary movements that are de-constructive & designed to destroy a system, they come in all shapes & forms, and they connect in with the Fabians. So much goes back to the Illuminati, of course, but where would you put it on the political spectrum, if even we can do that.

Frank: Well, its funny you should say, because we can actually use prophecy & the different groups that came together in claiming prophecy as a way of distinguishing. We really need to be clear on what the Illuminati is before we then make a distinction as to who is behind the insanity of the secularist movement.

Henrik: And that’s a good point, because there’s so many different interpretations. People also use the term ‘illuminati’ very, very loosely, or as a definition of basically everything that they are against, or has anything to do with conspiracy. And if you’re strict to the word, it usually means something very, very different than what most people, what they actually mean when they use the word. But go ahead…

Frank: So lets be absolutely ironclad clear who the Illuminati are, and then we can talk about who is behind the nihilistic madness of the world & and that refuse, flat-stick refuse, to bring themselves to account. So the Illuminati, as some may know, was formed, at least in name, by Adam Weishaupt, in Germany around the time of 1776, and one may argue there are remnants prior to that, and of course, a strong connection to the Jesuit model. The Jesuits, themselves, having been technically, or at least on paper, disbanded three years earlier. So there are all these connections to its origin.

So, let’s fast forward then, I don’t want to go through all that, because that’s something we can go through at another time. And its all well written on sites like One-Evil.org. But let’s fast forward to the last 50 years to what the Illuminati is today.

In 1961, there was an extraordinary event that took place, in the reconstitution of the Constitution & Rules of Order of the Sovereign Knights of Malta Order of Saint John. And what happened in 1961, for the first time in history, and really, this is Earth shattering when we talk about what the Illuminati is… In 1961, for the first time in history, you saw the amalgamation of a Catholic Order with the Protestant Order, so that the Protestant & Catholic elite for the first time came together under one structure. And the Jewish Lodgers that had a loose affiliation also came under this structure. So now, for the first time, we see Protestant, and variations of Protestantism with Catholic & Jewish elite for the first time together under one structure. And… Lodgers in the Middle East of elite Muslim families coming together.

So the first time in the this planet, first time, in 1961, a Constitution Rule of Order comes together where we see Catholic, Protestant, Jewish & Muslim Lodgers coming together as one.

Now, in that document – which is available, its publicly available, there are many, many places you can download it. You will see that the Sovereign Knights of Malta, which is the simplest way of describing the long-winded name, has three classes – a first, second class of membership & a third class of membership.

The third class of membership are those that are generals of military, esteemed politicians, leading artists, Noble Prize winners, heads of secret intelligence organizations, and other leading business & industrialists of society – that the third class of the Illuminati.

The second class is reserved purely for the heads of monarch families, queens, kings, emperors, sheiks – and they’re the second class.

And then, the first class, the class above all other classes, remembering this is a military & a religious order, so to be a member of the Illuminati, is to swear a sacred, and absolute solemn oath, both to a military & to a religious order – to become a religious. And could you imagine who the first class is? Its hidden in plain sight, in their Constitution.

Henrik: Tell us.

Frank: It is the Jesuits. Now, it doesn’t say the word ‘Jesuits’, it doesn’t need to. It simply describes an Order that is not required to be conventional, that is to live in habits and monasteries, that has sworn a sacred oath to poverty, obedience & chastity. And there is only one Order that fits that bill, and you know who they are. So, that is the first class of the Illuminati. And, in the second & third class combined, there are approximately 35-36 thousand members around the world. And they are the most famous people, the most famous artists, scientists, politicians, business leaders, military, religious.

Now, within that structure of the Illuminati (since 1961), there are two major operational roles. There is the
Grand Master, currently known as Mathew Festing, he is the Grand Master of the Order, and he is the public face. And there is a private-public role, as well, being the ‘Dame Hospitaller’. And this is in deference to that part of the Illuminati, that part of the Sovereign Knights of Malta, that combined with the Protestant arm, and the attendant Jewish & other arms. And the Dame Hospitaller? In the Protestant Movement, the Church of England… Who might you think that is?

Henrik: Queen of England… Elizabeth II, right?

Frank: Correct, absolutely. So, they’re the two public roles. But both roles report to the ultimate, ultimate head of the Illuminati in the world – the most powerful head of the Illuminati. It is a private-private role. And it is a purely spiritual role. And it is a purely guiding role. And given what we said about the misdirection on thinking that generals hold power, rather teachers. Would it not surprise you that the role is a teaching role. And it is the ‘Prelate’. When we talk about the Illuminati, who exactly are we talking about? And so, we spoke briefly about the Order being three classes of members. Third class being the vast majority of members – Prime Ministers, Ex-Prime Ministers, all the ex-Presidents of the United States are Sovereign Knights of Malta, President Obama is now, and will officially be recognized as a Sovereign Knight of Malta of the third class when he finishes.

The second class are your kings & queens & leaders at that level.
And the first class, as we said, are Jesuits. And that is the structure of the Sovereign Knights of Malta, & the elite, & the Illuminati today.

So, in terms of numbers, sheer numbers, around 36,000 in total in the second & third class, and there’s about 23,000, thereabouts, members in the Society of Jesus. We’re talking about 50-55 thousand, or so, members of the elite – the ‘true’ Illuminati, if you like, in the world. That’s all there is. And the leader, under the Constitution, is not the Grand Master, Mathew Festing, that we mentioned. And, is not the Dame Hospitaller. Both the Grand Master & the Dame Hospitaller confess to the Prelate. The Prelate is the head of the Illuminati, the Prelate is the most powerful member of the Illuminati in the world. That is the position.


As a teacher, as a guide, as a philosopher, as a theologian, to the elite. That is who is at the top of the tree.

Henrik: And who holds that title today?

Frank: Well, it’s a private title, it’s a private position, it’s given to the most senior & esteemed teachers of the Catholic Church. I presume it to be honorific, that is it’s a title & a role that once appointed is usually until they die, as opposed to the Rector of Gregoriana, which may turnover every 5 years, 6 years or 12 years. So there is someone who has, obviously, been at a senior level, like the Rector of Gregoriana Pontifica – the leading university in the world. Someone that is recognized as a leading theologian. And someone that has be obviously a Jesuit. And if they fit that qualification, then that’s the role. Now, that role is not only the spiritual head of the Illuminati, but may in fact may hold the Imprimata of the Catholic Church & the teaching power of the Catholic Church, the Magisterium, is personified usually in a great teacher. And that role, ultimately, has the authority to imprint, or deny, even the Pope in publishing material. So, there is indeed someone in that role. And they live pretty much in a fairly anonymous role in the world. The most powerful role in the world is virtually unknown. You could watch them going down the road, have a coffee, or be on a train or tram, and no one would know who they were.

Henrik: Well, that’s kind of how I always figured it to be. If we have the names of some of these people that we think are high up the ladder, I think we’re missing the point altogether. I think that we’re talking about organizations, well in this case we know the name, of course, if within these circles they are having secret meetings – not the Bilderberg meeting but things we don’t… we don’t even have the names of these things, that’s what I’m getting at, and we don’t have the names of the people, either.

Frank: Well, certainly to the elite of the world, to the Presidents & the ex-Presidents of the United States – and they are recognized as powerful people – the queen, and the royal families of the world, certainly hold sway. One could undoubtedly argue that those who are current heads of intelligence organizations & heads of the vast military network, surely have influence. And all these people – all of them report, ultimately, in the pyramid to the spiritual role, to this teaching role – the one that directs the past.

And the interesting thing is it was this role that recognized the importance of change, and this role with others that recognized the events that led to Benedict standing aside, being asked to stand aside, and agreeing to stand aside – an incredible role, an incredible change. And, the events that saw a Pope coming in for the first vicar of Christ since, virtually, 1100 CE.

Henrik: So, what was the reasoning behind this, do you think? Was it a PR move because all the **** that’s been happening to the Roman Catholic Church as of late?

Frank: Yes. Look, things don’t happen for one reason, so the answer is yes. But, then very, very much more than that.
Look, the people behind the…the most dangerous people on the planet, by the way, and I have to say this, and people may not believe it, I mean, its up to them, its up to people to choose… The most dangerous people on the planet are not the Illuminati.

The most dangerous people are people who openly celebrate madness, psycho-pathy, a lack of logic, a lack of reason. When people have a little bit of knowledge, a lot of power & are in an insular role, as are the nihilists & those in the nihilist movement who claim themselves to be inheritors of spiritual revelation, in the religious right in America, they are incredibly dangerous. And in fact an alliance was formed between the Hasidic leaders and the Sabbatine leadership & the Mormon Church, and the Religious Right – the Evangelicals, and that was & is still called the Zionist Plan.

Now, that has not & has nothing to do with labels. I am not going to use a label that is used all the time. It is an attitude. It is an attitude of people who have no foundation, other than desperately wanting to seize & maintain power. And who believe that they can continue to hoodwink the world by manufacturing what they claim to be messages from Lucifer.

Henrik: Well, I was going to actually ask you about that. I wanted to ask you about what you think about the theory that very high up in the hierarchy, maybe at the highest point, but maybe somewhere around there that there are, could be something that is basically not human. We can talk an entity from another place – Lucifer, a demon, or an alien, or a channeled entity – something like that. What do you think?

Frank: Well, I do believe that there is, in fact, a manifest spiritual entity, at the top of the tree, around these members that are loosely affiliated in the false nihilistic, quasi-Luciferean cabal that is formed from the leadership of the Hasidic Sabbatine, the Religious Right of American, and of course the Mormons, that have come together & believe that they can pretty much sprout, on a daily, weekly, monthly basis that they claim that God speaks to them, when really they are saying to other members of the elite, “I have message from Lucifer.”

And I do believe there is a spiritual influence that is participating in this. But we’re talking about people that have no genuine occult knowledge – no. It’s all false. It was manufactured – completely manufactured. It is nihilistic, in that they created it on the belief that they could herald their own greatness, their own brilliance. There is no real revelation or message. It is purely political. And, that message, when it is harnessed with real revelation, & even the Zohar from the fifteenth century has some real revelation, that harnessing has been the central driving force for nearly a century of these mad, mad, mad people, putting us in two World Wars, and desperate to put us into a third World War.

Henrik: Yeah, it’s unbelievable. And its funny too, how it seems that a lot of the orders from behind the scenes, and in some regards, even flat-out openly have been involving the sovereign military order of Malta, and the connection to some of the private mercenary armies, and such, that has been continuing what has been known as the Tenth Crusade, I think pretty much, you know, since the second invasion Iraq, and this is now basically spreading throughout the Middle East. And, I believe as well, Frank, that what we see with these ‘revolutions’, if you will, in Egypt, and ongoing in so many countries, Northern Africa & everything else. It’s just a continuation of that same war – that Tenth Crusade. But its very cleverly done, so its believed that its from a power that’s within the country, as opposed an invading force from without, but its still very much is an invading force. That’s what I see, anyway.

Frank: It is, but its also cleverly done in the guise that people believe it is the Illuminati, and that it is the Catholic Church, and its this traditional hierarchy, as opposed to a loose, sham group of nihilists that have members of that other order, but really are perpetrating a fraud – a great fraud – where there is nothing behind it. Look, do you remember George Bush saying God spoke to him?

Henrik: Sure, oh yeah.

Frank: Well that was a double message. What he was saying is to the public god, in our vision of god, in the divine creator, but what he was telegraphing to the rest of the world, and particularly to the old style, and, we are talking, then, about of the Illuminati, is that Lucifer… he was saying Lucifer speaks to him directly. That’s what he was telegraphing, okay. And that’s the calling card of the mental illness, and the absolute falsity of nihilists. They say, “I don’t believe it. There is nothing to it.” They believe they can con the world, and they have! They have absolutely conned the world. They’ve convinced the world that it’s an old European based influence that is driving the world, that its malevolent. Meanwhile, they’re all sitting in positions. They don’t have the education. They don’t have the inclination. They see power as a tool to play with & manipulate. They believe in absolutely nothing. And this is the most profound & dangerous force. And I believe, a line in the sand was drawn in 2012, or earlier, to say enough is enough. We’re not going to allow, what’s called the Zionist Plan, the Zionist Dream, to keep being the vehicle of this complete madness.

As I said, remember, I am not using labels. If I am going to use a label, I’ll call them for what they are – Khazar – loose affiliation of nihilistic groups, quasi-Christian groups, false history, Mithraic influences – but fundamentally sewn together with a central common theme of being nihilist. That’s who we’re talking about.

Henrik: Very, very interesting. Now, we’re going to take a break and continue to talk more about this. Try to get deeper into much of this, and to be able to decipher what is going on in the world, who are intending to take us there. And, of course what we can do to break out of that, of course.